Welcome to Jester's Trek.
I'm your host, Jester. I've been an EVE Online player for about six years. One of my four mains is Ripard Teg, pictured at left. Sadly, I've succumbed to "bittervet" disease, but I'm wandering the New Eden landscape (and from time to time, the MMO landscape) in search of a cure.
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Saturday, January 26, 2013

Only Kirk could go to Qo'noS

Focus: CSM Summit Minutes, "Ship Balancing" session
Focus: CSM Summit Minutes, "Null-sec" sessions


My parents and their parents had a saying: "Only Nixon could go to China."  The expression is based on the fact that Richard Nixon was a ardent anti-Communist.  So when he traveled to China in 1972, even people who were anti-Communist themselves could not argue that Nixon would be too soft during negotiations.  Anyone else without these particular "credentials" might be suspected of making accommodations.  My own generation, who were children or unborn when this trip took place, would be more likely to say "only Kirk could go to Qo'noS".  ;-)

Super-caps only come up three times in the December Summit Minutes.  The first time is very briefly during the Null-Sec sessions where Greene Lee again points out that super-caps need some control in place to limit their ability to project power across long distances.  The second time is equally briefly during the same session.  During this session, CCP Soundwave mentioned the idea of an upgraded form of Infrastructure Hub that would confer lots of bonuses, but the number of them in-game would have a hard limit; to build one, you'd have to take the core of someone else's.  Trebor Deahdoow picked up on that mechanic and mentioned that it might be used in some form to limit super-cap proliferation.

The third time was during the Ship Balancing session, on the top of page 50.  There were three paragraphs devoted to the subject.  I quote the first one in full (edited slightly):
Seleene raised the issue of super-cap balancing. Ytterbium informed the CSM that super-cap re-balancing was not on the immediate horizon and that there was no concrete vision for changes to them. Fozzie added that, while they wouldn't promise to re-balance super-caps balance in 2013, they wouldn’t exclude it either. Fozzie continued by saying that super-cap balance was an issue, but that they believe other balance issues had a higher priority. Alek, Seleene, and Elise disagreed.
The other two paragraphs once again mentions a super-cap role change (though since it's CCP Greyscale saying it, I do not think that phrase means what you think it means) and once again, the forever-mythical super-cap module used for tackling other super-caps.  Therefore those two paras can be safely ignored.

As for that first paragraph, do I have to mention how amusing I find it that Seleene and Elise Randolph of Pandemic Legion are arguing for super-cap balancing?  I guess I don't.  Do I have to mention how amusing I find it that CCP Fozzie (formerly Raivi, also of Pandemic Legion) is arguing that other ship balancing concerns have higher priority?  I guess I don't have to do that either.  But yeah, I'm doing it anyway, aren't I?  Oh well.  Only Kirk could go to Qo'noS, and only Seleene and Elise could argue for a super-cap nerf.

A cynical man would say that Pandemic Legion has already gotten a large bowl full of fun out of over-powered super-caps and they want to make sure that nobody else pulls together enough of them to have an equal amount of fun.  An even more cynical man would argue that Seleene and Elise know that Fozzie and CCP Ytterbium aren't going to get around to capital ship balancing before late 2014 at the earliest, much less super-cap balancing.  Therefore anything they say on the subject is
  1. not going to happen any time soon; and,
  2. is just the two of them making the right sorts of noises while not believing what they're saying.
Despite what you may think though, I'm not cynical enough to believe either of these things.  Still, when the CSM Town Hall happens in eight days time, I think I'll ask Seleene what he meant by raising this issue and what he thinks should be done about it.  Might be interesting to hear his answer and to hear if his thoughts on this topic have evolved any.

Finally, speaking of Kirk going to Qo'noS, I have for the third time appeared on the Declarations of War pod-cast with Alekseyev Karrde and NinjaTurtle, this time with mynnna (corestwo) as their other guest.  We had quite an interesting conversation about the CSM Summit Minutes!  mynnna's going to be elected to CSM8 no matter what I think, so it's fortunate that I think that he's a good choice for the GoonSwarm candidate.  I think he'll bring a lot of value to the CSM8 table.  If you're interested in this topic, go give us a listen.  Thank you for the invite, Alek!

Finally, if you're getting a little sick of CSM-related topics, don't worry.  The next several posts aren't.

9 comments:

  1. While it definitely carries weight that supercap pilots are calling for them to be further balanced (I don't think they explicitly asked for a nerf, so it's possible that they're just referring to balancing within the class), I don't think it's any more of a shocker than Hans advocating for FW balancing.

    That's not to say supers don't need rebalancing, but it's no surprise that two people whose gameplay revolves heavily around supers (not to mention that Seleene was actually responsible for designing them) are going to see even relatively small tweaks to those ships as far higher priority than people who are less involved with them.

    And honestly, it's not as if supers haven't been looked at for a while - more effort has already gone into balancing supers in the last two years than any other class. I doubt we'll ever reach a point where everyone's happy with them.

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  2. The most interesting takeaway here is that mynnna = corestwo. I've always been tempted to prod corestwo on the eve-o forums about all the helpful posts he makes in the Markets subforum. I thought the goal of the Goons was to destroy EVE for everyone else? corestwo/mynnna fails miserably at that Goon objective. Would make a good CSMer.

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    Replies
    1. Perhaps I have ulterior motives. ;)

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    2. mynnna gets one of my votes for CSM; Jester gets the other!

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  3. If you think supercaps are bad on TQ, look at serenity.
    http://killboard.nl/en/?a=kill_related&kll_id=459656

    Over there, supercaps are usually RMT'd or built from very high alliance taxes.

    But then again, we did just have that thing in Asakai, were you there to whore on mails?

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  4. Agree with Fozzie, regarding priorities. A handful of players fly supercaps; everyone flies subcaps.

    Expect Fozzie to do a great job on supercaps, when he does get around to them. Certainly, he can't do any worse than any of his predecessors.

    I fully expect supercaps to get hit with a massive nerfhammer when their time comes around. There isn't any other way to deal with supercap proliferation except to make them much easier to catch and kill.

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  5. I happen to remember the time when I didn't vote for Seleene for CSM (and stated so here) for the very reason of him not being in favor of nerfing supercaps.

    Hmmm.

    I kind of wish he'd run again for the post, so I would have the oportunity of NOT voting for him for an extra reason.

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  6. I hope you're done done with the posts on the CSM minutes yet. I can't wait to see what you're going to say about the Customer Loyalty program, and in particular UAxDEATH's comment. Here's my newb take on it (http://evechecklist.blogspot.com/2013/01/how-many-accounts-how-does-90-sound.html)

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  7. Picard went to Qo'noS ;p

    Nerd privileges revoked!

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