Welcome to Jester's Trek.
I'm your host, Jester. I've been an EVE Online player for about six years. One of my four mains is Ripard Teg, pictured at left. Sadly, I've succumbed to "bittervet" disease, but I'm wandering the New Eden landscape (and from time to time, the MMO landscape) in search of a cure.
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Thursday, October 24, 2013

CSM8 Status report: Week twenty-four

Where are the minutes?  Well, here's where we stand.

Of 25 total sessions:
  • I've written six sessions (Introduction, Sales and Marketing, Team Kuromaku, Team Game of Drones, NDA Project Three, Hilmar);
  • Trebor Daehdoow has written five sessions (PvE, CSM as Stakeholder, Security, Future Plans, Team True Grit);
  • Ali Aras has written four session (EVE Economy, In-Class Homework Assignment, User Interface, NDA Project Two);
  • mynnna has written three sessions (Reasonable Things, Team Superfriends, Team Five-0);
  • Mike Azariah has written two sessions (Art, DUST 514 Link);
  • Mangala Solaris has written one session (Language Support and the CSM); and,
  • James Arget has written one session (Launcher).
There are three sessions without minutes, one of which might end up being permanently NDA'ed:
  • State of Balance (being worked on by Chitsa Jason);
  • Projects One, which is still heavily NDA'ed; and,
  • EVE Valkryrie (being worked on by Ali Aras). 
In short, at this point CSM8 considers our work on the minutes essentially done, other than pestering Chitsa and Ali to finish their bits.  The Project One and Two sessions may never get written because so much of them deals with things that won't be released until the summer 2014 expansion.  As a result, if they were written much of them would end up reading like "CCP Fozzie then covered a series of subjects which are currently under NDA.  The CSM agreed with three of them, then asked for more information on two," et cetera.  It wouldn't make for very interesting reading, I'm afraid.

EDIT 24/Oct/2013: I have updated the list above to include two more summit sessions completed by Ali Aras.  First, the EVE Economy ended up being two sessions, the second of which was about an NDA'ed in-class homework assignment.  I'm not sure if it will ultimately end up getting NDA'ed, but I'll count it for now.  Second, she completed minutes on NDA Project Two.  The inclusion of the homework assignment technically means there were 25 sessions, not 24.  Thanks for the update, Ali!

I did go ahead and write a set of minutes for Project Three though, partially so I could say I wrote more of the minutes than Trebor (hee!) and partially because I do think CCP will announce this project sooner or later and I'm very very excited about it.  Even if I have to wait a while, I'll probably ask in due course to get those minutes released.  Trebor will probably get back at me by writing minutes for Project One or something under the same conditions.  ;-)

Speaking of Trebor, he wrote a couple of really good things that you should go out and read about the SOMER blink situation, one I describe as a good post and one that he literally described as a "shit post".  The latter is funnier.  The former makes better points and I quote his points in full:
  • This issue is not going to be resolved quickly. The problem was a long time in the making, and it will be months in the resolution, if for no other reason than there are significant legal issues CCP has to take into consideration. Furthermore, a quick resolution is unlikely to be one you will like.
  • Raging and repeating your position at every opportunity is not constructive, and actively hurts your argument. All it does is sh*t up the thread, and drown out other voices. If you want to be taken seriously, you want to encourage broad discussion. Threads that have a high percentage of posts by a small number of posters are not taken seriously by anyone.
  • The reason for the surveys -- both CSMs and CCPs -- is to gather more data from more members of the community. CSM needs that data in order to make the best possible arguments on your behalf; "the data says" is a better argument than "the opinion of my ass is".
Yes, yes, and yes.  I agree with all three of these points.

The situation with SOMER blink continues to be a topic of heavy discussions between CCP and the CSM, and is one of the main reasons why the minutes are being delayed.  Every member of the Community team including CCP Dolan are very much heads down on this matter.  However, that said, I did remind him that he is the only member of that team that can get the minutes out and he assured me he'd do everything he could to get the first block of them released as soon as possible.

In addition to myself, Mangala Solaris and Kesper North were at EVE Vegas this past weekend (one of the reasons this post is a couple of days later than it normally is).  While there, we all got ample opportunities to talk face-to-face with a large percentage of the 350 attendees.  For those of you that joined us there, thank you!  And I got to meet both Mangala and Kesper for the first time myself.  I mentioned to the organizers that if I'm on CSM9 next year (far from decided, obviously) then I'd be willing to either give a talk or run a round table at EVE Vegas next year about the CSM.  And if I'm not, I'll see what I can do to convince those who are on CSM9 to do so.

We're about at the point when I wanted to have the next CSM Town Hall meeting and I'm going to go ahead and start to work with Neville Smit and DJ Wiggles to schedule something.  Even if we don't have minutes to point to yet (although I dearly hope we do), it makes very good sense to meet with all of you in an open session and let you air your concerns about the SOMER blink giveaways and other matters.  First though, I want to chat with Ali Aras some more because she had some very good ideas about the Q&A portion of the meeting and I want to chat with her about them.  So look for that to be scheduled soon.

We're still very busy with CCP on the Skype channels and in the private forums.  This week, yet another surprise feature for Rubicon was announced and there just might be one more coming that the CSM has taken a keen interest in since planning for Rubicon started.  And if you paid attention to the EVE Vegas presentations, you've already heard about Ghost sites and the new player-built(!) warp speed implants.

Finally, I keep forgetting to mention this, but James Arget continues to do a great job on the csm8.org website.  Go give it a visit.

That's all for now!  We're almost at the half-way point in our term!  The time is passing quicker than I thought it would...


  1. I can make a constructive argument that CCP's legal department should have no problem understanding: I'm voting with my wallet and taking my gaming budget, both money and hours playing, elsewhere.

    1. Woot, one less bad to deal with!

  2. I'll toss this in as well.. there was a pretty good article in the NY Times last week, http://www.nytimes.com/2013/10/20/technology/this-is-war-for-a-game-industrys-soul.html?pagewanted=3&_r=0

    On the surface it's about EA's upcoming Battlefield release but it also contains a whole lot of insightful info on the gaming industry in general. BF4 Executive Producer, Patrick Bach, says this (direct quote from the article): "Don’t use data to decide what to do." They don't trust what the fans want. CCP doesn't either, apparently.

  3. "The reason for the surveys -- both CSMs and CCPs -- is to gather more data from more members of the community."

    Surveys? What surveys? Are players supposed to know they can state their opinion at those surveys? Or are internal surveys?

    1. The CSM wants to do a player survey to determine where players feel the line should be drawn here.

  4. "...summer 2014 expansion..."
    Hope it's something "good"

    "...there just might be one more coming that the CSM has taken a keen interest in since planning for Rubicon started."
    The more the beter

  5. Why does the image of the village people chasing Frankenstein with "torches and pitchforks" come to mind when I read your statement " run a round table at EVE Vegas next year"? :-)

  6. More time for analysis? Player survey?

    I see two logical explanations to how badly CCP is handling the SOMER of rage:
    a) CCP is a bunch of cynical assholes who only care how much money they make. They don't give a damn about EVE as a game, it's a business. CSM is just a puppet to amuse and distract the players evolved out of a face-saving PR smokescreen.
    b) CCP is a "family company" that aims to create a "friendly working environment" first and foremost. Which means anyone can work there no matter their competence or usefulness. Leadership, much less strong leadership, doesn't really exist; it's essentially a bunch of gaming enthiusiasts who play around in a big "game developer company" doll house. The only reason they still exist is because they have literally zero competition on their niche market.

    It should be noted that there's plenty of examples that can be used to support both versions outside of the SOMER fiasco. It should also be noted that no matter which version is true, the game is fucked.

  7. So let's see what the null sec cartels were screaming about wanting, then suddenly went mute. That would be anything industry based, that gave null sec more control over industry. mynnna and other cartel lackeys were whining "you need to nerf high sec NPC industry slots by a huge amount", and we have seen several posts by devs who wanted to wipe out T2 mfg in high sec, which naturally met with approval of the cartels. And there of course was the "nerf high sec refine rates, for the good of the game".

    On all 3 those topics they have stopped their forum propaganda campaign. Either one of 2 things is happening:

    1. Those are the NDA'ed items for the summer.
    2. CSM has been told "relax my null sec friends, handing you the PI tax income stream is just the tip of the iceberg. It will take a couple years, but when Seagull is done (which cartel is she with?), you will have the ability to control ALL high sec NPC stations, and set your own tax rates, so why bother wrecking high sec further when you will be the lords of that too? When we are done, your RMT streams, which we ignore like Somerset's, will be enhanced immensely".

    I wonder what items the goon economic cabals are going to "have guessed right on" again, come the April/May release of information about the summer iteration.

    1. I like the way your mind works.

    2. Evidence..do you have any?

  8. I have a write-up about the Ghost Sites that summarizes the announcements. http://pilgriminexile.wordpress.com/2013/10/22/ghosts-in-the-rubicon-machine/

  9. We're so far past some free ships that we're off the edge of the map. Somer is engaged in CCP condoned, sponsored, and publicized RMT. I'd get permabaned for what they do 24/7.

    1. This. Can't say it better myself

    2. Lemme know when Somer lets me cash out my winnings to my bank account.

  10. With time running out, is there an ETA to sisi for the remaining yurts?

    As for Somer - soap opera or soap box; take a pick. They have been in the game for how long now - and its suddenly all anybody wants to whinge about? I could not give a flying fornicate about the organisation. Gambling in any form is a tax for morons. So while CCP has to stamp out this fire, the patch fizzles. So is there actually anybody in the torch and pickfork crew an actual shareholder?

  11. It will be interesting to see if your survey even gets off the ground ... the surest sign of an impending shit storm is the quiet of enforced thread locks in Eve O forums.


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